This file is part of the Perl 6 Archive

Note: these documents may be out of date. Do not use as reference!

To see what is currently happening visit http://www.perl6.org/

Perl 6 Summary for 2004-11-22 through 2004-11-29

All~

Rather than try to do something witty about the strange music I am listening to, or the stuffed animals who are assisting me. I will start this summary off with an entirely self-serving request. <abuse>A while ago I saw the quote "Computer Science is merely the post-Turing Decline of Formal Systems Theory." without an attribution. I have tried to find an attribution for it, but have been unable to find one. If any of you know it, that information would be appreciated.</abuse> With that out of the way, I bring you

Perl 6 Language

Deep Operators

Last week, Matthew Walton wondered about Deep Operators and if they would work as he expected. As I tentatively predicted, the answer came back and was "yes". Then the thread got side tracked with context and Perl vs perl vs PERL concerns.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#5f2fea0de12b17ba

gather to separate bins

Dave Whipp wanted to know if he could use gather/take with multiple bins. Michele Dondi suggested using adverbs for it. Rod Adams pointed out that as gather is inherently lazy the two binned approach could cause strange results (like churning for a while filling one bin trying to get an element for the other). Of course, not being able to do it would mean possibly having to compute an expensive generate function more than necessary, unless it is memoized...

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#87aa6adbc75cf1af

\xAB in here-docs

Thomas Seiler has decided to test my copy-paste-fu by starting a discuss on characters that don't appear on my keyboard. His question was if \xABEND could start a here-doc. The answer appears to be no.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#7e652c58a92b8763 -- here-doc

\xAB != <<

The above thread led to a discussion of the various quoting operators, and the differences between \xAB\xBB and <<>>. This led to much discussion on the finer points of qw, qx, and qq (among others). Juerd suggested scrapping qx and qw in favor of qq:x and qq:w, which Larry liked. Rod Adams suggested scrapping <<END in favor of qq:h/END/, which I like.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#ab6622fc31d918f9

unifying namespaces

Alexey Trofimenko wondered about unifying the $, @, and % namespaces. Larry told him that this ship sailed long ago and that it was not changing.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#46454a84a9172df0

Lexing/Parsing Perl6 without executing code

Adam Kennedy wants to be able to syntax color (and possible perform basic programatic manipulations of perl6 code). Anyone who has used a good IDE like Visual Studio, Eclipse, or IntelliJ probably understands where he is coming from. He does not, however, want to execute arbitrary code in the process of doing this. Much discussion ensued, but it does not look like he will be able to do this. Quite the tragedy, but perl is simply too dynamic to be docilly lexed like static languages.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#33dac0ffef3f5412

Perl6 Compiler

Nice Work

Nick Glencross has the honor of the only message on p6c this week. But his sentiment is shared by all. Nice work, Patrick.

www.nntp.perl.org

Parrot Internals

Parrot_compreg.sig

Bernhard Schmalhofer noticed that Parrot_compreg had a different signature then documented, so he submitted a patch to fix it. Leo applied it.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#a12ef10c010ecaec

opcode numbering

Leo added a TODO ticker for opcode numbering.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#3de333c4d23c4ca9

tests pass, but create core files

I reported that on my machine all of the tests claim to pass, but core files appear in the parrot directory. Dan confirmed my suspicion that this was a real problem. I tried to supply helpful information like backtrace, but Warnock applies.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#d43f4106f2e905a5 -- initial message

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#c909c9babac8d80f -- squeeky wheel gets the kick?

pcc cleanup

Leo removed the recently deprecated P0, P1, P2 usage. Relatively few tests break as a result.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#ba0ef78e52148775

Namespace-sub invocation

Luke Palmer wanted to know if there was syntax for calling subs from a particular namespace. Leo provided the answer, call it as a method on the namespace PMC.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#66e7d4e7a7ab6ac2

Reserved Words Annoy

Luke Palmer wondered if he could define a .sub "new" to get around reserved word problems. Leo added the support, but warned him not to use "spaces or such".

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#d8b7d8f26eccaf63

Lexicals, Continuations, Register Allocation, and ascii art

This thread (and the ones that preceded it) have made me wish that gmail and google groups had a fixed width font option. Sadly, this summary will probably not get me it, as it did not get me p6c either :-( Ah well. The problems associated with lexicals and continuations churned. There was a plea for guidance from Dan. Hopefully he will guide us shortly.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#5d407a49e35702c0 -- one thread about it

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#c57b4637509a41ab - and another (with plea)

old Parrot question

Bloves had a question about assemble.pl in the parrot 0.0.1 source. Warnock applies.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#33970bc9a90a06cb

Parrot on Linux PPC build

chromatic managed to track down some of the PPC build issues for linux. Leo wondered where all of the config hackers went, I think he wants someone to fix it.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#20e082437de64106

preprocessor problems

Flavio S. Glock noted that the preprocessor did undesirable things. Leo suddenly realized that it was woefully out of date and need major fixing/disabling. Flavio submitted a small patch for it, but Leo pointed out that this was not enough to actually fix the preprocessor.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#8c9270a316157318 -- initial message

new push_eh opcode

Leo added a new push_eh opcode and derprecated the old set_eh.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#077a2262017fee69

TODO and RT wrangling

Will Coleda continued his stellar work managing the RT queues. Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon patched the first one.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#b11b6c59dab91269 -- remove Perl* PMCs (done)

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#4c254d61bdf2ffbf -- the patch

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#7fb65a1c7cd9a169 -- make Perl* PMCs dynamic

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#ef890a6842435659 -- IMCC Documentation needed

PMC does "hash|array|monkey"

Will Coleda added a ticket for the does functionality. He promptly closed it when Leo pointed out that it already existed in the form of the "does" op. So Will up and started using it.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#fcf7be31e8c07a97 -- initial request

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#7133a04b64d46880 -- Tcl takes advantage

Strings are in

Dan announced that the last of his string stuff was checked in and he would like brave souls to help him merge it back into the tree.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#d413362b93c0b8d4

Language TODO tests

Will Coleda thanked Josh Wilmes for fixing the Language TODO tests. And apparently one of Tcl's has mysteriously started working.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#f8c3302fed106b0e

minesweeper broke

Jens Rieks noticed that somewhere in the shuffle minesweeper got broken. As a professional minesweeper-er, this shocks and offends me. Leo offered a pointer as to where to start looking to fix it.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#fc395ff103bccd69

@ANON subs

Leo added some support for anonymous subroutines. People liked them and began. Luke Palmer prompty tried combining it with @IMMEDIATE and began to wonder if it was immediate enough.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#a7d9e8b2ea97a641

Parrot Grammar Engine issues

I think that I shall continue to spell out PGE for a little while, but I may decide to use only the acronym in some later summary without warning, be prepared. Oh right, the whole reason I mentioned it in the first place... Will Coleda pointed out a few issues including (1) doesn't compile by default and (2) doesn't compile at all. Nicholas Clark fixed (2), and Patrick figured that (1) could wait until it was a little more mature. Personally, I feel that maturity is over rated, poo-poo head.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#c18f2e2beaaedb2b

(Java|ECMA)Script on Parrot

David "liorean" Andersson wondered if there were any projects to run JavaScript on Parrot. While there does not appear to be, many people thing it would be a good idea and offered useful pointers.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#635e61453b2ad086

Rules Engines

Cindi Jenkins posted a link to an interesting blog entry on Rules engines. Unfortunately, I think she posted it to google groups as it did not find its way onto the list. Also, unfortunately, it is a post about logic rules engines a la prolog and not grammar rules. although who knows, there might be some overlap...

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#fb96b1b98e28df7a

PIR examples on the website

Herbert Snorrason noted that there were no PIR examples on the website and opened a ticket for it. Will took a first pass at it.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#ed6e93528eb83000 -- original message

www.parrotcode.org

testj string_102 issues

Luke Palmer found a subte looking problem in string_102.pasm. Leo couldn't reproduce it and suggested that it might be a redhat thing. Peter Sinnott chimed in with a possibly unrelated failure also on redhat.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#7df630bb59973686

Tuning and Monitoring

Matt S posted a question about how much internal tuning and monitoring Parrot would allow. Unfortunately, I think he posted it to google groups, as it didn't show up in my inbox. I am honestly not sure how much is available/in the works.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#6bedca9a038ed1d9

missing directory in MANIFEST

Andy Dougherty submitted a patch fixing a missing directory in the manifest by allowing ops2pm.pl add it.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#ff859e67ee2aa353

Objects, Classes, Metaclasses, and tall people's heads

Dan posted a refresher on the current state of the object system. He then went on to explain where it was headed and conjectured that this would be enough. Just reading his description of it hurts my head enough that I do not wish to guess if he is right or not.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#cddac16c4d298d65

eof opcodes

Brian Wheeler wondered why there was no "eof" opcode. Leo told him that it was a method on a PIO object. Apparently most of the IO opcodes should actually be PIO methods, go figure.

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#f140e6aa524b48a0

ops to deprecate or not

Leo attempted to trim down the core by removing some opcode variants. Dan did not appreciate the change and told Leo to roll it back. Fortunately, Dan went on to explain the longer term goal (which should satisfy Leo).

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#282ffc0fcf893f3e -- initial posting

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#9f6119f5da401c99 -- CVS commit message

groups-beta.google.com&_doneTitle=Back&&d#9ca142664145ad61 -- the goals

The usual footer

If you find these summaries useful or enjoyable, please consider contributing to the Perl Foundation to help support the development of Perl. You might also like to send feedback to [email protected]

donate.perl-foundation.org -- The Perl Foundation dev.perl.org -- Perl 6 Development site planet.parrotcode.org -- Parrot Blog aggregator